Science Fiction & Fantasy Asked on July 8, 2021
During the trio’s meeting with Sirius in his Hogsmeade hideout, Sirius seems to be much kinder towards House Elves.
“Hermione’s obsessed with house-elfs,” Ron muttered to Sirius, casting Hermione a dark look. Sirius, however, looked interested.
“Crouch sacked his house-elf?”
….
“Hermione, will you give it a rest with the elf!” said Ron.
Sirius shook his head and said, “She’s got the measure of Crouch better than you have, Ron. If you want to know what a man’s like, take a good look at how he treats his inferiors, not his equals.”
Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire, Chapter-27, Padfoot Returns
How did the same man go on to treat Kreacher horribly in Book-5, that it ultimately resulted in his (Sirius’s) death?
In GoF, he seems sensible enough to know that House Elves are at the mercy of the families that own them, and hence need to be treated well. Despite his family baggage, he must have known that Kreacher wasn’t responsible for showing his displeasure at the Order. And that his behaviour would improve if Sirius tried to be nicer to him.
‘Sirius!’ she said reproachfully. ‘Honestly, if you made a bit of an effort with Kreacher, I’m sure he’d respond. After all, you are the only member of his family he’s got left, and Professor Dumbledore said–‘
‘So, what are Umbridge’s lessons like?’ Sirius interrupted.
Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix, Chapter-14, Percy and Padfoot
‘I warned Sirius when we adopted twelve Grimmauld Place as our Headquarters that Kreacher must be treated with kindness and respect. I also told him that Kreacher could be dangerous to us. I do not think Sirius took me very seriously, or that he ever saw Kreacher as a being with feelings as acute as a human’s–‘
Quoting Dumbledore from Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix, Chapter-37, The Lost Prophecy
Why did the sudden change in Sirius’s personality take place? Did Rowling start shaping his character differently in OotP, or was Sirius just being hypocritical in GoF?
Do we see any other instance where Sirius interacted with, or spoke about another House Elf, and what was his outlook on that occasion? Any quotes from canon explaining this shift in attitude would be appreciated.
I would say it is consistent with someone who hates so much his family and everything to do with them. There are many indications of this throughout the books, I gathered some of them here.
Sirius hated his mother:
[Sirius' mother portrait] "Filth! Scum! By-products of dirt and vileness! Half-breeds, mutants, freaks, begone from this place! How dare you befoul the house of my fathers"_ ...
"Yoooou!” she howled, her eyes popping at the sight of the man [Sirius].
"Blood traitor, abomination, shame of my flesh!”
“I said — shut — UP!” roared the man, and with a stupendous effort he and Lupin managed to force the curtains closed again ...
“Hello, Harry,” he said grimly, “I see you’ve met my mother.”
"Your — ?”
“My dear old mum, yeah,” said Sirius. “We’ve been trying to get her down for a month ... "
Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix - Number Twelve, Grimmauld Place
and from later in the book:
My mother didn’t have a heart, Kreacher,” Sirius snapped. “She kept herself alive out of pure spite.
Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix - The Noble and most Ancient House of Black
When Harry and Sirius examine the family tree tapestry, the disliking was apparently mutual:
"You’re not on here!” said Harry, after scanning the bottom of the tree.
“I used to be there,” said Sirius, pointing at a small, round, charred hole in the tapestry, rather like a cigarette burn. "My sweet old mother blasted me off after I ran away from home — Kreacher’s quite fond of muttering the story under his breath."
Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix - The Noble and most Ancient House of Black
He did everything to say he was different from his family
When Harry enters Sirius' room in Grimmauld Place:
Sirius seemed to have gone out of his way to annoy his parents. There were several large Gryffindor banners, faded scarlet and gold, just to underline his difference from all the rest of the Slytherin family.
Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows - Kreacher's Tale
Sirius almost obsessively hates his family, from a very young age, so I don't see how he can see Kreacher (who was serving the family back then) as something other than a constant reminder of them.
Not really fond of his other family members either
The fact that his brother was a Death Eater and obsessed with Voldemort, wouldn't have made him very happy (He didn't know Regulus changed his mind and tried to destroy the Horcrux obviously):
"Sirius’s brother?” she whispered. “He was a Death Eater,” said Harry, “Sirius told me about him, he joined up when he was really young and then got cold feet and tried to leave — so they killed him...
Whereas Sirius had sought to advertise his difference from the rest of the family, Regulus had striven to emphasize the opposite. The Slytherin colors of emerald and silver were everywhere, draping the bed, the walls, and the windows. The Black family crest was painstakingly painted over the bed, along with its motto, Toujours Pur. Beneath this was a collection of yellow newspaper cuttings, all stuck together to make a ragged collage... “They’re all about Voldemort,” she said. “Regulus seems to have been a fan for a few years before he joined the Death Eaters..."
Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows - Kreacher's Tale
Actually he said directly he hated all of them:
[Harry] "But . . . why did you . . . ?”
“Leave?” Sirius smiled bitterly and ran a hand through his long, unkempt hair. “Because I hated the whole lot of them: my parents, with their pure-blood mania, convinced that to be a Black made you practically royal, my idiot brother, soft enough to believe them..."
Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix - The Noble and most Ancient House of Black
Kreacher constantly mumbling about all this
As for Kreacher, the constant mumbling about Sirius' mother, purebloods and traitors wouldn't have helped in seeing him as just a house-elf.
The elf took absolutely no notice of Harry and the rest. Acting as though it could not see them, it shuffled hunchbacked, slowly and doggedly, toward the far end of the room, muttering under its breath all the while in a hoarse, deep voice like a bullfrog’s, “...Smells like a drain and a criminal to boot, but she’s no better, nasty old blood traitor with her brats messing up my Mistress’s house, oh my poor Mistress, if she knew, if she knew the scum they’ve let in her house, what would she say to old Kreacher, oh the shame of it, Mudbloods and werewolves and traitors and thieves, poor old Kreacher, what can he do...
Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix - The Noble and most Ancient House of Black
As for speculation, probably the fact that he was forced to stay in the house he so much hated, with constant reminders of his family wasn't really helping him see things from a more calm and logical perspective.
Correct answer by elrond on July 8, 2021
I don't have any additional quotes to support this, other than those provided in elrond's answer, which I think go some way to explaining why he dislikes Kreacher specifically (because he is linked to everything he hates about his family).
My speculation is that his outlook didn't change, but rather that he never really viewed Kreacher as having feelings to begin with, and never unlearnt that behaviour, even as he learned about other house-elves and formed his own views on house-elf rights.
I would assume it is some form of unconscious bias - Sirius worked hard to distance himself from his upbringing, and formed views that were much more liberal than his family. However, whenever he was around Kreacher, he was always around a family that taught that Kreacher was less than human, and would have been taught that from birth. And because he detested Kreacher personally, he never made an effort to challenge himself on that.
So, he knows theoretically how he wants house-elves to be treated - but has a blind spot about Kreacher that he never bothers to question.
Answered by Luna on July 8, 2021
Just wanted to add to the excellent answers already here...
If you want to know what a man's like, take a good look at how he treats his inferiors, not his equals.
This doesn't mean that he necessarily has enlightened attitudes on house-elves. He's merely making a point about Crouch. I read the passages where the gang discuss this, and IMO, I don't believe we can draw too many inferences on how Sirius feels about house-eves. He seems more interested in Crouch's behavior. In fact, you could even make the argument that this is benevolent racism.
IMO, We don't have enough information from this exchange alone to confirm that Sirius has liberal attitudes on house-elves. I couldn't find any other passages where Sirius comments on house-elves in this book, but I could be missing something.
Answered by GuestDood on July 8, 2021
There wasn't a shift in Sirius' attitude toward house-elves between the books. The only house-elf we see Sirius interact with on-screen (err...on-page) is Kreacher, which colors our perception of him. Dumbledore outright says that Sirius was kind to house-elves in general and his treatment of Kreacher was an exception.
"SO SIRIUS DESERVED WHAT HE GOT, DID HE?" Harry yelled.
"I did not say that, nor will you ever hear me say it," Dumbledore replied quietly. "Sirius was not a cruel man, he was kind to house-elves in general. He had no love for Kreacher, because Kreacher was a living reminder of the home Sirius had hated."
Answered by Jay on July 8, 2021
Sirius doesn't have a prejudice against house-elves in general, but he hated everything about the Black family and that includes Kreacher. Take this line from Order of the Phoenix:
"Kreacher! That's enough of your bile. Away with you!"
Sirius said this after Kreacher called Hermione a Mudblood, which incited Sirius' hatred of his family and their beliefs, rather than his hatred of house-elves in general, especially based on what he says to Hermione in Goblet of Fire about Winky and Crouch.
Answered by ava on July 8, 2021
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