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Is Thibado’s Graphene Brownian Capacitor Charger Perpetual Motion of the Second Kind?

Physics Asked by James Bowery on December 21, 2020

In Fluctuation-induced current from freestanding graphene (peer-reviewed version on Phys. Rev. E, note: behind a paywall) Thiabado, et al, report the extraction of work from brownian motion. The experimental set up involves graphene in close but insulated contact with an electrode that charges a battery and a storage capacitor until a switch shunts the potential through a resistor.
enter image description here

This seems to be a Feynman-Smoluchowski ratchet hence perpetual motion of the second kind. If so, where is the flaw in the experiment?

2 Answers

The interpretation is almost certainly wrong. A graphene film cannot "ripple" due to a static, spatially uniform temperature. It can only mechanically deform in response to a changing temperature or a temperature gradient. If all the calculations are done properly, the graphene film device will be determined to be a heat engine whose performance is consistent with the usual laws of thermodynamics. I can't state that from direct evidence (i.e., an experiment that measures temperature and entropy changes associated with this device), but the indirect evidence is overwhelming.

Answered by S. McGrew on December 21, 2020

Thibado "published" about this idea three years ago https://researchfrontiers.uark.edu/good-vibrations/ enter image description here https://youtu.be/wrleMqm3HiU

He now added complications (diodes etc) but that won't help.

The system with mechanical noise makes it a bit more complicated but not really different from a resistor with thermal noise. It is like trying to get energy from the thermal voltage of a resistor. Cannot be done.

Edit: there is an obvious source of energy in the schematic of their new preprint: that battery. I suspect that the bias voltage is the source of the power that they detect. (But I have not analyzed this in detail.)

Answered by Pieter on December 21, 2020

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