Personal Finance & Money Asked by Nathan Reading on March 18, 2021
I am refinancing my first mortgage (no cash out). The new loan amount is about 58% of my purchase price (purchased 14 years ago). The loan amount is also about 52% of an appraisal I paid for 5 years ago and 44% of a more recent property tax valuation. And, get this: The loan amount is only 96% of the tax valuation of the land.
However, the bank will not waive an appraisal. (In fact, the bank wants to sell the loan through Fannie Mae, and I think it’s really Fannie Mae who won’t waive the appraisal.)
I understand that a bank (and whoever buys a mortgage) has many forms of risks when it loans money. One of those is the risk that the house is not really worth enough to serve as collateral for the loan. So appraisers serve a valuable function. But anyone (like a bank mortgage officer) who can see the 5 dollar figures that I used to calculate percentages above can immediately see that the bank’s risk, in the value of the home, is zero. Under these circumstances, paying more than $500 for an appraisal is nothing more than throwing money away.
Is there any way to get the bank, or Fannie Mae, to see reason on this?
Parting thoughts:
If the government is anywhere close to correct on this valuation, I could close on this loan, cancel my insurance and burn my house down, and the bank would still be able to recoup most of its money from the land. (This is a hypothetical, to argue a point. No arson planned.)
You might want to say that I shouldn’t worry about this, because it’s a tiny part of a large transaction. You’re right. But nobody wants to throw $500 away. And it bothers me to pay for an appraisal when an appraisal is so nonsensical.
I just refinanced with a much higher LTV than yours (75%) and no appraisal was done. Anecdotal for sure, but obviously it's possible. Furthermore, your Loan Officer should have the ability to cover some of your fees at their discretion (mine covered 100% of the fees so the refi was free.) I wouldn't be surprised if given your low LTV, that when presented with the potential loss of a sale, that the LO will either eat the appraisal fee for you, or convince the bank that an appraisal isn't necessary in the first place.
As a side note, my bank did require me to continually provide updated paystubs to prove I was still employed. I had to provide them 3 times over the course of the 2 months process.
Update: I was notified yesterday that my loan was purchased by Freddie Mac, so at least we know with certainty that they don't have a recent appraisal requirement under certain conditions.
Correct answer by TTT on March 18, 2021
I suggest you seek out other financing options and use that possibility either to get a better deal entirely, or else to convince your current bank that you will go elsewhere if not satisfied.
If your current mortgage prevents you from doing so without paying some type of penalty, you would need to weigh the penalty against reduced interest costs & cost of appraisal.
Answered by Grade 'Eh' Bacon on March 18, 2021
The requirement for appraisal is to avoid some of the problems that existed in the housing bubble in the mid 2000's. Some companies took shortcuts or they approved mortgages without requiring people to document income. In other cases appraisals were inflated. The idea was that as prices continued to skyrocket, there was always somebody to to sell a risky mortgage to. Until there wasn't.
In your situation you believe the numbers are good. Keep in mind that in some places tax values are divorced from what the property can sell for. Also what it sold for or was appraised for X years ago is meaningless. They want the picture from today.
Your best hope of skipping the appraisal is to find a lender that doesn't sell their mortgages.
Here is what Fannie Mae says about appraisals for refinances:
Use of an Appraisal for a Subsequent Transaction
Fannie Mae will allow the use of an origination appraisal for a subsequent transaction if the following requirements are met:
The subsequent transaction may only be a Limited Cash-Out Refinance.
The appraisal report must not be more than 12 months old on the note date of the subsequent transaction. If the appraisal report is greater than 4 months old on the date of the note and mortgage, then an appraisal update is required. See preceding section, Age of Appraisal and Appraisal Update Requirements, for requirements for completing an appraisal update.
The lender must ensure that the property has not undergone any significant remodeling, renovation, or deterioration to the extent that the improvement or deterioration of the property would materially affect the market value of the subject property.
The borrower and the lender/client must be the same on the original and subsequent transaction.
That is their policy. They don't want an appraisal older than a year.
Answered by mhoran_psprep on March 18, 2021
There is no way the bank will see reason on this.
Have you ever made a special order at McDonald's, like, say, a Big Mac without pickles, and the cashier shoots you a dirty look? And you think, "What the heck? It should be easier to make a Big Mac without pickles than a Big Mac with pickles? You should give me a happy look and also you should charge me less!" But the cashier knows the normal process it to create a lot of Big Macs with the standard set of ingredients so they are available as soon as the customer orders them. A special order requires more attention from the McDonald's crew and you will wait longer to receive your order.
A $500 procedure to protect a 5 or 6 figure investment is almost always a good idea from the bank's perspective, and it is deeply entrenched in their normal operating procedure. A loan application without an appraisal, for whatever reason, will take a lot longer to process as each step in the loan processing workflow has to manually override their internal procedures and risk controls to push the application through. The hassle to the bank will be worth a lot more than $500 to them, so they will do what they can to avoid making an exception for you.
Answered by mob on March 18, 2021
There are many factors that go into whether or not a bank will waive the appraisal beyond just the loan to value ratio. Some factors, such as if you live in a flood plain or if the loan is over a set amount, will necessitate an appraisal no matter what the LTV is.
Answered by Kevin on March 18, 2021
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