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Re-learning how to corner aggressively at speed after bad experiences

Bicycles Asked on June 7, 2021

I’m not quite sure if this should somehow be broken up into two questions, but what can one do to take sharp corners at speed effectively, especially when you’re nervous after having bad experiences riding?

I’m already familiar with common techniques for high-speed cornering on a theoretical level (cf. a video from the Global Cycling Network), but I was never really good at taking corners hard. Now, however, after being in an accident with a car and afterwards having only ridden a lot in miserable conditions (snow, ice, sand/gravel on the road because of the snow, etc.), I realize that I simply don’t do sharp turns… and trying to force myself to do it makes me extremely nervous.

Possible aggravating factors

  • Ill-suited bike: Perhaps it’s the one rideable bike I’ve currently got? — it’s a lot lighter and "tighter" than my previous training bike, which makes it seem fun to ride, but it just feels squirrely… yet that could simply be me not used to it.
  • Interference from similar sports: Between the accident and the winter, I was on a motorbike quite a lot, and I feel much more confident on it than I do on a bicycle despite going over twice as fast. However, the thing weighs 220kg as opposed to maybe 13kg, and you hug a motorbike in a way you don’t/can’t on a pushbike. Also, when cornering on a motorbike, it’s completely normal to use the rear brake to control your speed; I find I’m instinctively trying to do this on a pushbike but it just makes me feel weird, and I don’t even know if you can do this safely on a bike, anyway

Are there no "baby steps" I can try to do in order to get myself to corner properly and aggressively and yet to trust myself/my bike at the same time?

6 Answers

I'm only posting this as an answer because it seemed long to comment.

But i would run some drills maybe once a week or whenever your free time allows. Go to a sports store and get some little multi sport cones, or use beer cans or toilet paper rolls or what ever else you have that won't hurt you or the bike if you run it over or fall on it.

Two drills that may help is a large slalom where you need to tightly weave back and forth. The other being a large circle.

Start with ample room where it is almost too easy, then as your confidence and speed increases, decrease the size of the shape or row, there by increasing the angle and lean that you need to use.

You could even go as far to set up a small sprint course either in grass or a parking lot depending on how you feel, and start tracking you time. That way your not racing anyone but yourself and your own head.

It may take awhile to build confidence but repetition is key, after a while that fear should slowly start to shrink. Likely you have some degree of PTSD from the event, some may think it's silly but its very real. I was in a head on 60mph collision (in a car not a bike) about 6 months ago, and unfortunately have to drive on that same 2 lane strip everyday to work, and still i get anxiety going through there, it's a 2 lane underpass, old road so it's narrow, with guard rails on either side so there is no where to go. Guy came into our lane and there was nothing we could do but wait to get hit. Point is, it gets better it just takes time and repetition.

I have also found it helped my cornering a lot to concentrate on my position relative to the bottom bracket, sounds goofy but consciously being aware of my bad form and working on it with similar drills helped me gain a lot of confidence, i had similar issues when i switch from a 2.35" mountain bike to a road bike, just didn't feel right.

Correct answer by Nate W on June 7, 2021

I've raced a bit and crashing is a part of the racing. After every crash - the worst one being actually on the road - riding headlong into a car - I completely lose confidence on the bike. Its like a fear of the next accident waiting around the corner.

I rebuild confidence by riding cross or mountain bike. I relearn all the bike handling skills - I tend to lose on the road bike. The advantages being no cars and a soft landing.

Answered by OraNob on June 7, 2021

I've lost count of the accidents I've had. The best way for me to regain confidence is to wear safety gear. But I'm a very rough rider at any time.

The safety gear gives me the confidence to go back to pushing limits.

Answered by Kilisi on June 7, 2021

Maybe it is just evolution's way of asking you to increase the chances of passing your genes onto future generations? Of course, it must be balanced against the greater number of potential mating partners who will be attracted to you as they watch you taking corners faster and lower, and seeing you in the top spot on the podium.

Answered by Craig Hicks on June 7, 2021

I think the best way to build confidence cornering aggressively is understanding cornering principles and then practice doing them without leaning too much. From there progressively increase speed plus lean without going past the limits. I think throwing your hands up and saying well crashes happen or go ride off road for a while is selling yourself short and not necessarily addressing the a lack of confidence cornering.

Some fundamentals on a bike are:

  • Brake upright prior to the turn. If you have to brake during the turn I prefer to use the rear brake and that is similar for me on a motorcycle too.

  • Your line should be Outside, Inside, Outside. It minimizes the time your bike is leaned over and allows you to carry maximal speed through the turn.

  • You should also look through your turn and Outside, Inside, Outside path you plan to take. Also, you should be firm, but loose on the handle bars. Like a motorcycle if you have a death grip on the handle bars it makes the bike more unstable and twitch as the bars slightly will move as the tires adjust to terrain in an attempt to stay upright.

  • Prior to leaning you should have your inside foot and pedal at 12' oclock to avoid it hitting the ground and avoid pedaling until you are straightening your bike back up as you exit the turn. I also slightly stand on the outside foot to act as an anchor to allow my upper body to lean towards the inside of the turn and my inner leg to be unloaded. This is similar to the leg work when cornering on a motorcycle as in the outside leg acts as an anchor for your lower body so that your head and upper body can lean into the turn. This through the magic of physics will allow you to go through a turn at a given speed while minimizing lean angle.

  • If you are traveling around 18 MPH or more you should initiate the turn by counter-steering like on motorcycle. You also should be in the drops on a road bike when cornering aggressively or at least the hoods.

You can see some of that here on one of my rides around my favorite hairpin on a warm up @4:37:

As an external reference you can check out Twist of the Wrist by Keith Code for motorcycles. They do one of the best jobs explaining cornering physics and I find almost all of it translates to bikes including shifting body weight to the inside in an attempt MINIMIZE lean angle while maximizing speed.

Answered by Tude Productions on June 7, 2021

Well, having respect for what can happen is a good thing! It's what keeps you alive.

That said, there are two things you need to consider:

  • Tire crawl: There are bicycle tires that are just squirmy. When you lean a bit into a corner, the inner flank collapses somewhat while the turning tire is loaded, causing the bike to move in a direction that does not coincide with the plane of the wheel. This crawling easily kills any confidence you have in your bike. I guess, motorbike tires don't do that at all.

    Good tires are stiff enough to retain shape in aggressive corners, giving you a feeling of riding on rails. This builds confidence. Like when you are on a motorcycle.

  • Road conditions: As I said, respect for the possibility of slipping is a good thing. Cyclists typically ride much closer to the physical limits of cornering than motorists, including motorbike riders, do. As such, we need to be much more aware of the road surface where we are going to ride through corners. A slightly moist road can be enough to get a cyclist of their steed, and you need your eyes to do it safe. Look ahead to judge the conditions well, then you can be confident when you go through the corner that you won't be surprised. I guess you do that on your motorcycle as well, or are you only ever riding when the sun is shining and the roads are perfectly dry and clean?

Also, keep in mind that slipping away once in a while is perfectly normal when biking, especially with bad weather conditions when you wouldn't even think about mounting a motorcycle. When I commute to work in winter, I expect to slip away at least once per winter. That's ok, though: When I happen to slide in winter, I'm typically dressed rather thickly, my arms and legs don't have time to get into any odd angles, and the ground I'm hitting is slippery rather than abrasive. Those are the accidents where you scream sh*** once, get up, brush the snow from your clothes, recover your bike, check that the handlebar is still straight, mount, and continue on your way. The better the road conditions, the less likely you are going to slip, and on a dry, clean road, it should be next to impossible with good tires.

TL;DR: The better your tires, the easier it is to gain confidence in them.

Answered by cmaster - reinstate monica on June 7, 2021

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